Thread: Detroit

I think first you need to define "cesspool"....

You already know my feelings on Detroit, lol, so I guess I will just state that I am not suprised.

#1this NOT a debate board. So hopefully you meant debates at your own board.
#2 The fact that people were overpaid for doing nothing. I'm talking about the automakers of course. People got to sit at home and get paid! Are you freaking kidding me? Plants shut down and they were still paid! Not to mention the fact at the wage some of them are/ were earning. There are fair/good wages and then there are just overpaid.
Also you have management and execs being paid OVERLY abundent pays!
Heck this can be said for the fall of some of the banking crisis as well, NOT just people recinding on the mortgages!

And yes I meant my OWN debate board. I meant I wanted opinions here. Hence the sentence "I wanted to post it here to see what sort of comments I get here." Please excuse my lack of obviously necessary clarity.

Pepperpot, I think the video defines cesspool pretty well. I'll try to find another link if that one's not working. In the video they show areas that received millions and millions of dollars for improvement that are so amazingly awful that I don't even have words for it. The guy goes into abandoned homes that are only homes in the sense that they are mostly wooden structures bigger than garden sheds where people once live an drug dealers now squat while methodically and literally tearing the place apart.

ETA video link : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hhJ_49leBw

Originally Posted by janelle

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1hhJ_...=stevencrowder

Are you talking about this video? I didn't want to put it on here since it if from a very conservative web site and I thought it would only cause arguments. ??? If you have another video post it since I haven't seen it.

Yes, that's it too. Thanks. It is a very conservative POV. IMO it's also full of excellent points. It is a bit "blame only one side" but Detroit is very only one side too and look at the condition it's in.

I'm a social liberal in that I don't believe government has any business in our bedrooms, parenting (barring abuse), or marriages. I do believe in helping people. I also believe in a hand up, not a hand out. IMO, Detroit is an excellent example of what happens when the handouts not only keep coming but are expected and people form their way of life around them.

Profound short paragraph
You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the
wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working
for, another person must work for without receiving. The government
cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first
take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that
they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care
of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to
work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my
dear friend, is the beginning of the end of any nation. You cannot
multiply wealth by dividing it."*

* Adrian Rogers, (1931-2005)

I watched the video. What they have shown is an abandoned area, I didn't see anyone 'living' there. Okay, I recall one guy in the background looking cold by a fire hydrant. There are areas similar to these in almost every city or town.....especially one where a 'major industry' has 'dried up' or 'left'. It reminds me of a video I saw of a guy riding a motorcycle through Russia where the nuclear plant contaminated. Anywho, there are lots of places like those.

I do think it has more to do with the handout/entitlement mentality and model than unions. My dad was UAW and he didn't see money like that nor did he have a 'luxurious' healthcare plan.....what they offered was a step above the 'welfare' level. Were things 'covered'? Yeah, but there was a definite lack of quality. So I think their assessment of the unions is a bit off. I'm sure some members in the unions would fit their description, but not the majority.

I'm not pro-union, there was a need for them at one point in society, but I think for the most part, that 'need' has come and gone.

ETA: I don't recall my dad ever getting 7 weeks of vacation, maybe 4 or 5 and he was there (union), I want to say for 40 years or so.

Just another thought to enter the 'equation'......

Isn't the government just another 'union'? only larger? The government mandates, not negotiates, but mandates the minimum salary one can earn, OSHA (yes a necessity but sometimes corrupt), etc. and is now going to mandate what healthcare must be provided.....the cost of these things comes from somewhere....

Another issue not really addressed was imports and outsourcing. Industries are dying in this country not just from 'unions' but the 'public' wants things cheaper. I needed help with my printer, I spoke to someone in India or so. The government is also 'forcing' these industries to go overseas for their solutions to keep costs low.

They are heavily taxing businesses here and they will go elsewhere.

Also, diversifying. If an area is counting on one industry and the 'trend' of that industry changes.....then Detroit will happen.

But the bright side is.......if the new 'trend' is wind energy (as an example).......there's a lot of space at a very reasonable cost to be had in Detroit to build a windmill manufacturing plant. The substructures/infrastructures are already there. That is if the government doesn't over-mandate to the business man and he can produce this product at a reasonable cost to him.